This is the record of the Online Workshop on 'Using NLP in Training and Learning' led by Andie Hemming here on TrainingZone on 29 February:

[andie hemming] Hello! I'm Andie Hemming and I'm today's workshop leader. The subject is Using NLp in training and learning. I am a Management Development Consultant and a qualified NLP prctitioner. I am also currently studying for my Masters NLP certificate. I'm a great fan of what it can do when training and developing and I think it has many applications - from workshops to one-on-one coaching. What sort of areas would you like to include in our discussion today?

[andie hemming] Hello Les - you're the first on - welcome!

[Les Jones] Hi. First time I've particpated

[andie hemming] Oh great! I have participated in Andrea's Presentation skills workshop - it was very interesting!

[Les Jones] Where and when was that?

[andie hemming] Please see transcripts of the last forums - all on this site.

[Les Jones] OK thanks.

[andie hemming] Hello Tim!

[Tim Pickles] Hi Andie - glad to see you're here!

[andie hemming] Me too!

[Tim Pickles] Hi to Les as well - we need to wait a few minutes to see who else is tuning in

[andie hemming] Hello Martine - welcome!

[Les Jones] Hello Tim. Sorry, Ive been away fetching coffee

[martine barclay] Hi there

[andie hemming] Hi Eraine amd Jackie - bog welcome!

[andie hemming] Sorry - that shouldv'e read BIG welcome!!!!

[Jackie Bufton] Hi - this is Jackie - this is the first time I have tried this so I might need guidance

[andie hemming] Hi Maggie!

[Tim Pickles] Andie - I just emailed to say I may have to pick someone up later this lunchtime

[andie hemming] Jackie - don't worry - all will become clear if you just watch for a minute or two

[Maggie Taylor] I am with yo u on this Jackie - this is all new to me - forgive my slow typing!!

[andie hemming] Hi Catrina!

[Eraine Morris] hi everyone, ditto jackie re first time

[andie hemming] Well - this looks like a party! Certainly enough to get started!! Welcome one and all - what would you like to discuss on our NLP forum?

[martine barclay] I have been looking into NLP courses and wondered what they gave delegates that was different from standard courses

[Jackie Bufton] I was wondering how I could use NLP with computer training and adults

[andie hemming] Hi Sarah - we're just getting started!

[Eraine Morris] In my experience, more insight, retention, and emotive involvement

[Sarah Herries] Hi all!

[Eraine Morris] whoops

[andie hemming] Jackie - I think it's ideal for this. Especially as computer training can be a dry subject. NLp includes techniques for accellerated learning and also helps you as the trainer to build rapport much more quickly with your delegates.

[Jackie Bufton] hi to everyone coming in

[andie hemming] Hi to Kevin, Jim and Jane - welcome!

[Jackie Bufton] I have tried just recently using mind maps and some games, but am very inexperienced

[andie hemming] Hi Andrea - loved your presentation skills forum - great to have you here!

[Kevin Weedon] Hi Andie! just taking a peek...

[Jim Ewan] Hi all

[Andrea McHugh] Hi Andie, and thanks.

[Catrina Alferoff] Hi from Catrina. We're researching older workers and learning and training. i'm sure you are aware of the problems involved. Is there a role for NLP here?

[Tim Pickles] Andie - would you (or others) like to give a couple of examples of 'NLP in practice' to illustrate its use?

[Maggie Taylor] yes please

[Sarah Herries] Getting some NLP Trainers Training can really help in making any subject compelling, interesting and fun!

[Tim Pickles] Hi Michael, we're just getting going

[andie hemming] NLp involves the study of both the conscious and unconscious processes that combine to enable people to do what they do. Mind mapping is a really good example of this. However I find it especially useful in t&D for tapping in to how others process and think and it gives me the ability to talk back to them 'literally in their own language'.

[michael gray] hi to everyone

[andie hemming] Hi Michael - welcome aboard!

[Jackie Bufton] do you use music in NLP?

[martine barclay] Are there any 'soft skills' topics where using NLP is particularly effective?

[Les Jones] Andie, can you expand on the mind-mapping remark?

[andie hemming] Other useful applications of NLP include goal setting and achievement, changing bad habits, building rapport quickly, dealing with past issues that hold people back, buildinmg on the skills of others, and learning them for myself, maintaining confidence and understanding how I manage time.

[Jane Townsend] Hi everyone, I'm just looking in out of curiousity

[Jackie Bufton] I have been using Mind Maps to help people remember which Menu to use to find specific facilities when working on Excel.

[Sarah Herries] I use music often to influence the 'state' of my participants and therefore make the learning more effective

[Kevin Weedon] I've recently been on an introductory day of NLP training, and am hoping for more later this year - does anyone know of any useful resources to help me prepare for that? Online or otherwise...

[Jackie Bufton] what type of music can we use?

[andie hemming] Jackie - yes, music can be excellent. You can use music to anchor mood or an activity or also use music in a certain beat/time to aid learning (e.g. Baroique music which is othen at the same speed as your resting heartbeat.

[michael gray] i use mind maps to help people who get blocked on writing reports and assignments

[andie hemming] good idea Michael - how do you do this?

[andie hemming] Hi Phillip !

[Sarah Herries] Oh no! Have to go, hope to be with you again. Bye

[Andrea McHugh] Andie, do you know of accessible Practioner training courses in Scotland? Many seem to be in England and involve weeks or weekends away and this is not feasible for me.

[michael gray] Andie, I take them gently through some examples, perhaps from a non work issue, that's it

[andie hemming] Hi Andrea - hmm I don't off the top of my head but will do some research for you and get back to you.

[Maggie Taylor] A great music site on the web for special boroque tapes etc is superlearning.com - it is American but they will ship.

[Jackie Bufton] Maggie thanks for the web address for music tapes I will check it out

[michael gray] Andrea, i'm also interested in Scotland - where i'm based

[Jackie Bufton] With regard to music - I am working with a group of 16-18 yr old students - I don't really think that Baroque music would be their cup of tea, any suggestions

[andie hemming] Hi Clive - welcome!

[Tim Pickles] With a large number of participants, following threads in a workshop can be awkward. I suggest we focus on one topic at a time for a few minutes. What about starting with 'uses of NLP' then ''where to get NLP training'

[andie hemming] Jackie - some of the 'ambient' music that's currently around is just as good - it needs to invoke a semi-hypnotic trance state

[michael gray] jackie, I've also worked with this age group - maybe they can find their own music with the appropriate beat

[andie hemming] Good idea Tim - thank you! I've shared a list of what's useful for me - what's useful for you guys?

[Eraine Morris] Eraine Morris , I Have seen Nlp Used extremely effectively during a ropes course instruters course, it encourages without presure and drives from within.

[Jackie Bufton] Thank you andie and michael - michael their music probably includes really heavy metal type of music. Andie could you give me a better idea what is Ambient music

[andie hemming] Hi Robert!

[michael gray] work on varying language in business communication to match teh recipient

[andie hemming] Jackie - yes, but I'll have to do this off line - will send you an e-mail!

[Robert] Hi Andie!

[Jackie Bufton] thanks andie

[Andrea McHugh] NLP dealt effectively and quickly with my arachnaphobia, and also is extremely useful in creative writing - creating three dimensional characters and situations.

[Robert] I'd be interested to know how NLP dealtwith arachnophobia.

[andie hemming] Andrea - yes, I agree. The use of metaphor is explored a lot in NLP and of course this is the language of our subconscious and dreams - all signals to our conscious mind!

[Jim Ewan] and i'd be interested in how NLP deals with phobias in general

[Jackie Bufton] Could I use metaphor in computer training?

[Maggie Taylor] Andie - could you please e-mail me with the ambient music too - thanks !

[andie hemming] Jim - there is a tried and tested quick phobia cure in NLp. I've had it done on me - for snakes - and done it on others. It;s an excellent technique

[Andrea McHugh] I think an expert needs to explain how phobia cures work, but for me it was interesting that it worked even though I didn't particularly think it would.

[andie hemming] Jackie - yes, you could use metaphor a lot in computer training - to describe how the processes work - e.g. "it's like...."

[Robert] I believe I use metaphors all the time in my conversation, but without really knowing whether my metaphors carry the same significance to other people as they have for me. I suppose that is partly waht NLP is about?

[Jackie Bufton] Would you use descriptive, narrative metaphor or would you use visuals

[Jackie Bufton] Does NLP take into account different learning styles of students

[Jim Ewan] Surely "it's like .." implies a simile not a metaphor. Or am I wrong/pedantic?

[andie hemming] All phobias are as a result of a traumatic experience (either consciously or unconsciously) and what the phobia cure does in a nutshell is go back to root cause and deal with it - effectively re-writring the tape where the trauma was to take the sting out of it.

[andie hemming] Hi Kelly - we're talking about the use of metaphor in NLP and also about the phobia cure! Amongst other things. Welcome!

[andie hemming] Jim - of course you're not pedantic! However, some of the computer ideas/concepts are difficult to get one's head around and a useful metaphor or story - ot indeed similie! - can be the thing that makes the delegates go 'aha!'

[Jackie Bufton] one example of metaphor in computer training would be likening electronic file management to that of a filing cabinet

[michael gray] Andie, do you or others use anchoring (isn't the principle similar to phobia cures) to build confidence in people, for example if they have todeal with work experiences they find difficult?

[Jim Ewan] Jim Ewan] aha!

[andie hemming] Jackie - absolutely it does. Learning styles are slightly differently 'measured' for NLP - concentrating more on whether people process information in a visual sense, an auditory sense or a kinesthetic sense (feelings) .

[andie hemming] Bit simplistic - for which apologies!

[andie hemming] Jackie - yes!! That's just the one that made me understand it!!

[Jackie Bufton] So visual metaphor could be useful for the people who prefer 'visual' processing, whilst talking about the subject will suit the audiory person

[andie hemming] Michael - I find anchoring as a concept EXTREMELY useful. Not only to identify the positive and negative anchors for people - and myself- but replacing them with helpful ones instead - eapecially anchiring positive states to call upon when needed.

[andie hemming] By the way - hi Derek!!

[michael gray] Andie - i find it really good too and very accessible for course participants

[andie hemming] How do you use it Michael?

[andie hemming] Jackie - yes, absolutely spot on for the metaphor. The more 'rep' systems (visual auditory or kinesthetic) you can build in to any one metaphor, the more people you will touch with it.

[andie hemming] Hi Marie - you're back!

[michael gray] I use it when i deal with topics like staff discipline - so that people can anchor positive states and take them into the scenario, and i've used it forme too when a situation seems tough - new training course and new delegates

[andie hemming] Michael - oh excellent!! This is also re-framing too?

[Jules] hello

[andie hemming] Hi Jules - welcome! We';re having a wide ranging discussion here!

[Jules] what on!?!?

[Jules] isn't it NLP today?

[Jackie Bufton] How could anchoring be used with computer training?

[michael gray] I also use a technique for me and with others called "circle of excellence" which works for me and others

[andie hemming] Ah - NLP in training and development! We're talking about metaphor, phobia cures and the use of anchoring.

[Andrea McHugh] How does that work Michael?

[Jules] wht is anchoring

[Jackie Bufton] what is a circle of excellence?

[Jules] sorry if i joined abit late

[Jules] busy day

[andie hemming] Yes!! Don't you love the circle of excellence!! I also use Anthony Robbins' Power Move when I'm, dealing with non-NLp-ers - similar technique however!

[andie hemming] Hi Jo - welcome!

[michael gray] it's about recalling a positive state and, for me, holding it in a circle - you can make one out of a peice of string and pop it in your pocket for instant use

[Jackie Bufton] is there any reading I can do on circle of excellence?

[michael gray] Andrea - i can email you some more detail - are you a prospective NLPer based in Scotland?

[Andrea McHugh] Thanks Michael, sounds interesting

[Jules] pleas mail me any useful info

[Andrea McHugh] Yes please Michael and yes I am based in Scotland

[andie hemming] A stimulus which is linked to and triggers a physiological state is called an Anchor in nLP. This can be anything from a piece of music that takes you back to a special event, a person, a smell - pretty much enything

[Jim Ewan] Jim Ewan]I'd like details of the circle idea too please, Michael

[andie hemming] Jackie - yes, I'll e-mail you

[Jackie Bufton] thanks andie

[andie hemming] Hi Derek!

[andie hemming] Oh - and of course anchors are not always positive! For example, whenever I smell boiled cabbage I go right back to school days! This is not good!

[Derek Jackson] Hello - I would be interested to know if anyone here has used NLP modelling to design training or learning events

[michael gray] Andie - can you replace it though, or is it just too powerful?

[Kelly Mason] Sorry to join the chat a bit late - I'm a chatroom and NLP virgin but am enjoying the discussion. could I please have details of the circle idea as well Michael?

[andie hemming] Yes Derek - especially when I experience a new teacher/trainer and I - and more importantly the group - like what they do. I'll then pick it apart to see what they do - and also ask lots of questions if I'm able! Also there are quite a lot of books available on the subject (see Amazon.com for a good selection.

[Jackie Bufton] Would you use NLP to design a full event - or would you use NLP techniques within the event?

[andie hemming] Hi Kelly!

[andie hemming] Sorry Micheal - replace what?

[andie hemming] Jackie - more probably the latter.

[michael gray] andie i meant the trigger from the smell of cabbage - serious point, are some triggers too strong?

[Jackie Bufton] could you use scent to involke a 'mood' or feeling in the training room?

[andie hemming] I haven't found any yet that didn't respond to the Collapse Anchors technique - although I guess there's always the exception to the rule!! Luckily, the school stuff has no sting in it for me now - but it certainly did at the time!

[Derek Jackson] andieandie - I can understand that you may model the trainer - however do you also use NLP to refine that model and communicate it toother trainers?

[Kelly Mason] Andie - What's the Collapse Anchors technique?

[michael gray] Jackie - yes, I'mstill surprised at how the effect of smell is discounted, thenwhen i talk to people about it they have lots of associations

[andie hemming] Jackie - yes, although again you'd have to be a little careful because of asthma/hayfever/allergies etc. When you are doing deep techniques on NLp with a room full of people it is always a good idea to have some scent going as all this neurological shifts produces some strange smells!

[Jackie Bufton] michael where can I find more details about the use and effect of smell?

[Maggie Taylor] I have to go now - however many thanks for the great discussion - I definitely will be 'chatting ' again - now I feel more confident with the prodedure. Thanks Andie -

[Jackie Bufton] Bye Maggie

[andie hemming] Derek - I guess I usually model for myself.

[andie hemming] You're welcome Maggie - thanks for joining us!

[michael gray] Jackie - don't know; i discuss it on courses and a colleague uses oils and scents to trigger relaxation and positive states

[Jackie Bufton] does anybody else know of information on scent and its use?

[andie hemming] Collapse anchors is a technique that uses a physical stimulus to anchor both the negative state and the positive states that are going to 'overwrite' them.

[Kelly Mason] Also have to go but thanks for the welcome Andie - I'll return to other workshops having gotten over the first step now

[andie hemming] Jackie - if you look at any info on aromatherapy this will give you your answers - lavendar, rose and geranium are, I believe, very useful in producing relaxed states. Lemon produces an awake and aware state.

[andie hemming] Great Kelly - see you again! (See??)

[Jackie Bufton] Thanks andy - more reading I guess

[Kelly Mason] I take it you are a visual person then Andie, thanks again and cheerio!

[andie hemming] Yes you're right!! Take care, have a good week

[Eraine Morris] this is absolutly fasinating, I know there are thousands of providers of NLP training can you recommend one?

[andie hemming] If anyone wants a 'starter for 10' for reading, I recommend 'Introducing Neurolinguistic Programming' by Joseph O#Connor and John Seymour, published by Thorsons.

[andie hemming] Hi Nick - welcome!

[michael gray] Andie - yes, i've read it and it's one of the clearest i think

[andie hemming] Eraine - I really recommend a guy called Ben Drake. He's on ben.drake@virgin.net. He runs an NLP practitioner certificate course (7 straight days usually in London - quite a lot of pre-course work required).

[Jackie Bufton] What about accelerated learning practioners - and courses

[Eraine Morris] Andie, excellent , thankyou for that

[andie hemming] Jackie - I have less info on this specifically. Michael - do you know more about this?

[andie hemming] Hi Jacqui!

[Jim Ewan] Jim Ewan. oops I got lost!

[andie hemming] Oh dear Jim - are you ok now??!!

[Jackie Bufton] Jim you need anchoring!!

[andie hemming] Ha ha - like it!!!!!!

[Jim Ewan] JimEwan] yes thanks, but I missed a huge chunk

[Eraine Morris] Andie, how do you rate the brren course's?

[andie hemming] Don't worry - you can view the whole transcript once Tim puts it up on this site.

[michael gray] A bit, Andie; I used a really good book called "the Creative Trainer" whcih built on left brain/right brain" work but i can't remember the author just now

[Eraine Morris] sorry Mackenna Breen

[Jackie Bufton] Michael thanks i can find out from the title

[andie hemming] Eraine - Well - if I'm honest I wouldn't touch it woth a bargepole - this is because it's mass market stuff and you get a lot less personal teaching and coaching.

[Eraine Morris] I too would strongly recommend 'the creative trainer' and would love a follow up

[michael gray] Jackie, it was really useful and now i wonder who i lent my copy to

[Eraine Morris] Hmm glad we concur

[andie hemming] Another good book is 'Training with NLP - skills for Managers, Trainers and Communicators' by Joseph O'Connor and John Seymour - also published by Thorsons

[Jackie Bufton] Eraine - if you are interested in the topic of accelerated learning I too would like more follow up on this subject

[andie hemming] Hi Steve - glad you've joined us for the last 5 mins!!

[Jackie Bufton] Eraine - I just realised you may mean follow up to the book - sorry

[Steve] Hi andie - I know did i miss much?

[Eraine Morris] Jackie same with accelerated learning, just cn't accelerated type.

[andie hemming] Well guys - we've only got a couple on minutes left. Anything anyone wants to discuss in particular?

[andie hemming] Steve - loos out for the transcript later when Tim puts it on the site

[Jacquie Turnbull] Just nice to make contact for the last ten minutes - hope to contact again

[Jim Ewan] Jim Ewan] What's the best intro to NLP. I probably mean book

[Jackie Bufton] As my first time in a discussion it has worked well for me - I would like more thankyou

[Eraine Morris] intellectual copyright on NLP?

[Andrea McHugh] Thanks very much everyone - I've enjoyed the discussion.

[andie hemming] Sprry Steve - that should say 'look' - terrible typist that I am!!

[michael gray] it's been a reallygood learning workshop; thanks Andie and you all

[Steve] I did want to ask what your thinking is on healing and NLP - too late!!!!!!!

[Eraine Morris] thankyou Andie and all its been great

[andie hemming] Eraine - that's an interesting one. I hear that Richard Bandler is thinking of suing all the NLP people for breach of copyright - I don't think he's get away with it.

[andie hemming] Steve - I have loads of info on this - please e-mail me separately to follow up if you'd like.

[Steve] what is it? andie

[Eraine Morris] I hope not itf he succeeds we should repackage the initials, and resist the courts

[andie hemming] Well - out of time! I've really enjoyed our discussion! Thank you very much everyone who has been on - over and out and Happy Nlp-ing!!